[Kirkscustoms]

New to this forum, seeking help/advice
2017 eco boost, daughters car bought new feb 2018.
same cylinder 4 misfire I see on many other threads, happened just after 60k warranty expired. Dealership backlog over month and a half anywhere close to me.
took to my longtime mechanic, replaced plugs, #4 coil (now I know that was not the right coil) and wires. Still same problem, took it back, couldn’t duplicate issue. Neither could I. Daughter mad at both of us, fast forward to now;
Engine overheated, had towed, low coolant, still misfire on startup, rough idle. Now diagnosis head gasket. All dealers near me say replace engine, talked to several specialty shops same thing. No one wants to touch the head gasket.
out of desperation I called Ford today, here’s what they said; take car to dealer, call us back with provided Claim reference number we will work with dealer going forward and fix.
This sounds too good to be true, or they know they have a problem and are only helping pay for those that actually file a claim.
can someone shed some light here. I’ve got a $21,000 yard ornament on my hands

 

[Blaby]

The cylinder head gasket may develop a coolant leak into the engine combustion chamber


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[Kirkscustoms]

The cylinder head gasket may develop a coolant leak into the engine combustion chamber


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We’re already there, there’s no may, it’s blown.

 

[MrScharfenberger]

They know they have a problem and are being extremely nice to work with you on this since it broke so soon after warranty. My A/C evaporator coil went out with only 25,000 miles on the car but it was way past the time limit. Ford replaced the evaporator coil for free anyway. I guess that's just how they roll... I'll take it.

 

[Kirkscustoms]

They know they have a problem and are being extremely nice to work with you on this since it broke so soon after warranty. My A/C evaporator coil went out with only 25,000 miles on the car but it was way past the time limit. Ford replaced the evaporator coil for free anyway. I guess that's just how they roll... I'll take it.

Thanks for the reply. I’m just really Leary of trusting a stealership, never dealt with one that was honest.

 

[zhent]

We had one member a couple of months back who had the issue out of warranty and Ford came through with a partial deduction on the cost.

If they actually decide there's an issue that they should be paying for, I'm going to be stuck looking for a lawyer to try and recoup the money I already spent for a head gasket replacement. My car was still under warranty, but I couldn't find a dealer willing to do the work under warranty.

 

[Kirkscustoms]

We had one member a couple of months back who had the issue out of warranty and Ford came through with a partial deduction on the cost.

If they actually decide there's an issue that they should be paying for, I'm going to be stuck looking for a lawyer to try and recoup the money I already spent for a head gasket replacement. My car was still under warranty, but I couldn't find a dealer willing to do the work under warranty.

WOW! You just confirmed my suspicion. Dealer I bought it from, service manager said wouldn’t discuss replacing gasket his approach was new motor recommended by Ford. It’s just pitiful.

 

[hiddenpants]

WOW! You just confirmed my suspicion. Dealer I bought it from, service manager said wouldn’t discuss replacing gasket his approach was new motor recommended by Ford. It’s just pitiful.

maybe they dont have the facilities to machine the block and head? especially if its been overheated slapping a headgasket in probably wouldnt help without a machine shop leveling everything

 

[MrScharfenberger]

maybe they dont have the facilities to machine the block and head? especially if its been overheated slapping a headgasket in probably wouldnt help without a machine shop leveling everything

Dealers don't usually do the "machine shop" part of it. They send that stuff out. At least all the dealers I've ever been to don't have a full machine shop. Maybe the ones in LA or Chicago but not around me.

 

[zhent]

Thankfully I never overheated mine. They confirmed the head hadn't warped and did just the gasket and head bolts. At the time I was checking my fluid levels weekly, so immediately noticed when it would drink antifreeze...

 

[Kirkscustoms]

All you guys that are pretty up on doing mods to these motors; How damn hard would it be to replace the head gasket? And use the crower gasket and upgraded arp bolts. It’s a 4 cylinder!
Now before I get slammed, I’ve been ridding and wrenching for 40 years, hot rod Harley bikes, custom built choppers, custom sheet metal work, gas tanks, custom exhaust, paint work, machine work. I mean it can’t be that hard can it, maybe a little tedious, but really.
Please fill me in,

thanks,

 

[MrScharfenberger]

All you guys that are pretty up on doing mods to these motors; How damn hard would it be to replace the head gasket? And use the crower gasket and upgraded arp bolts. It’s a 4 cylinder!
Now before I get slammed, I’ve been ridding and wrenching for 40 years, hot rod Harley bikes, custom built choppers, custom sheet metal work, gas tanks, custom exhaust, paint work, machine work. I mean it can’t be that hard can it, maybe a little tedious, but really.
Please fill me in,

thanks,

Doing that would be fine if you are going to also do all the associated machine work. I.E. deck the block & mill the head. That of course is a complete removal & disassembley of the motor. Not to mention that pesky reassembley & like I said associated machine work.

If you just replace the head gasket it's going to do it again. Nothing is going to be flat. To me the only way this would be acceptable is if the professor did it to get Gilligan off the island. You know... A one way trip. Just my 2 cents but I speak from experience also.

 

[Kirkscustoms]

Doing that would be fine if you are going to also do all the associated machine work. I.E. deck the block & mill the head. That of course is a complete removal & disassembley of the motor. Not to mention that pesky reassembley & like I said associated machine work.

If you just replace the head gasket it's going to do it again. Nothing is going to be flat. To me the only way this would be acceptable is if the professor did it to get Gilligan off the island. You know... A one way trip. Just my 2 cents but I speak from experience also.

The insight I was hoping for, hoping you would chime in. Picked up “get it off the island” loud and clear. Understand the head definitely would need some machine work. Now the block, is it mainly that it’s a sleeved aluminum block that you would assume it would need to be decked? I’m figuring/hoping the block would survive since this car hasn’t been tracked and seen some of the abuse I’ve read that these are subjected to. I have a hard time paying $140/Hr stealership rates knowing they’re just showing up for work, no skin in the game. I just feel it would be worth a try as opposed to taking a beating selling as is.
Thanks,

 

[MrScharfenberger]

The insight I was hoping for, hoping you would chime in. Picked up “get it off the island” loud and clear. Understand the head definitely would need some machine work. Now the block, is it mainly that it’s a sleeved aluminum block that you would assume it would need to be decked? I’m figuring/hoping the block would survive since this car hasn’t been tracked and seen some of the abuse I’ve read that these are subjected to. I have a hard time paying $140/Hr stealership rates knowing they’re just showing up for work, no skin in the game. I just feel it would be worth a try as opposed to taking a beating selling as is.
Thanks,

The problem is when an Aluminum block heat cycles hundreds or thousands of times with the head bolted to it they deform more or less together. Unbolt that head and have it milled flat is fine but then the mating surface of the block deck is still really no longer flat. Not like it was from the factory and look how that head gasket worked out. That gasket blew for a reason. Probably not a bad gasket either. Aluminum blocks also deform more over time than the old iron blocks but they still do it to. Not having everything flat on a carbureted car is a little safer (still not good). Crank a bunch of boost into the cylinders and you will quickly find out how flat your block wasn't. When I say all of this it isn't guaranteed to happen this way. It is just much more likely to happen this way...

 

[Kirkscustoms]

The problem is when an Aluminum block heat cycles hundreds or thousands of times with the head bolted to it they deform more or less together. Unbolt that head and have it milled flat is fine but then the mating surface of the block deck is still really no longer flat. Not like it was from the factory and look how that head gasket worked out. That gasket blew for a reason. Probably not a bad gasket either. Aluminum blocks also deform more over time than the old iron blocks but they still do it to. Not having everything flat on a carbureted car is a little safer (still not good). Crank a bunch of boost into the cylinders and you will quickly find out how flat your block wasn't. When I say all of this it isn't guaranteed to happen this way. It is just much more likely to happen this way...

I definitely get your point, I thought the same thing was just hoping against hope I guess. Still trying to figure out what to do with the damn thing. Think it’s leaving the island as is, any money spent going forward is a waste, considering it was bought new.

 

[Coyote Chaser]

All you guys that are pretty up on doing mods to these motors; How damn hard would it be to replace the head gasket? And use the crower gasket and upgraded arp bolts. It’s a 4 cylinder!
Now before I get slammed, I’ve been ridding and wrenching for 40 years, hot rod Harley bikes, custom built choppers, custom sheet metal work, gas tanks, custom exhaust, paint work, machine work. I mean it can’t be that hard can it, maybe a little tedious, but really.
Please fill me in,

thanks,

Sounds like you're qualified!

When I assembled my last build, I sent both the engine block and the head to the machine shop... Not sure if this was a bit of an over kill, what do you guys do?

Also, has anyone ever used, what we (back in the day) called "head rings" or "fire rings" (and I recently read a post where they were calling, something similar, an "O rings") on an all aluminum motor.

 

[hiddenpants]

Sounds like you're qualified!

When I assembled my last build, I sent both the engine block and the head to the machine shop... Not sure if this was a bit of an over kill, what do you guys do?

Also, has anyone ever used, what we (back in the day) called "head rings" or "fire rings" (and I recently read a post where they were calling, something similar, an "O rings") on an all aluminum motor.

i have only seen those rings being put into high power cummins trucks and if i remember right the machine shop had to cut a groove for them.

i would personally always get the head machined as it has to come off anyways but i would check the block with a straight edge. if its not warped then just send it. There are ways to " machine " a block and head at home but personally its not worth the risk. there are sanding blocks you can move over the head that level it and you can out some paper on something perfectly flat like a big piece of tile and slide the head across it to level it but thats more of a " i need to get my tractor running " kinda fix not something you would do to a modern turbocharged car

 

[hiddenpants]

as for if your qualified i personally believe that i could do any work required on my car, however at a certain point its a better idea to have a professional do the work. I changed a clutch in my 2014 dodge dart with no prior experience in doing clutches. it was super rewarding when i finally slapped it all together and the car ran and drove again after sitting in my single car garage in pieces for ~6 months.


but that leads into my next point, if you dont have the time, experience, and tools you can get hung up on things a professional wouldn't. The reason i decided to do the clutch myself is because the dealer quoted me 3k to do the clutch on the car, and independant shops refused to work on the car ( seriously 4 told me i have to go to a dealer they cant do it ) so instead of doing that i purchased a clutch masters aluminum flywheel, and fx250 clutch for the car and figured i would have it done in a couple weekends. every time i touched the car i would make some progress then end up stuck on something hard to do, or having to go buy new tools, or buy parts i didnt think i would need. like i have never heard of etorx before, but i had to buy a whole set to remove the subframe of the car, tore a boot on the stearing rack and had to find and buy new boots for it, so many of the bolts were corroded in so i had to buy a new impact wrench, i bought 3 different jack setups to get the clutch in before having to make a platform to sit on a atv jack so i could lift and slide the trans back in. seriously i got stuck not being able to get the tranny back in the car for about 3 months ( of working on it in occassional weekends and evenings on the car )


so im not trying to talk you out of doing it, by all means go for it. Just be prepared for it to take longer and cost more than just taking it in to a shop to do it. By the time i was done the clutch on the dart i spent about 2k in parts, 1000 in tools and jacks, 200 in fluids, 500 in replacement parts i didn't expect, 6 months of making payments and insuring on a car i couldnt drive and i had to buy another car to drive while i was doing the work. because my spuce was getting tired of not having her car. I would probably do it again because its so satisfying when it starts back up after sitting knowing you made it work with no experience and an internet connection. when it was done i was so exited i immediately took it for a drive before putting on the front bumper, wheel guards etc. i even just had the fog light bulbs just dangling. And i had to get it fixed so i could trade it in for my 2016 ecoboost premium

 

[gatornek]

but that leads into my next point, if you dont have the time, experience, and tools you can get hung up on things a professional wouldn't.

This has been a hard lesson for me to learn. I've enjoyed doing the maintenance and mods and my car...and even fixing it when things have busted. But man...its stressful when you come to a roadblock. In particular if the car is you daily driver, and its not like you can be without it the next day. It's like a layer of added pressure I don't appreciate....until its done and dusted.

 

[Kirkscustoms]

I want to thank all who have posted on this thread for all of the insight and advice. Especially the unfiltered advice. I like those the most.
this particular headache I’ve had has moved on, daughter is in a different car that she says she actually likes (she says) and hopefully she’ll take care of this one. Like some on here have stated it’s hard to work on something that’s a daily driver, especially if it’s someone else’s daily, highly stressful.
what I’m most disappointed in is Ford, this is the second Ford I’ve owned that when what used to be repairable, now requires a new motor. I’m sorry, that’s totally unacceptable. Acceptable if you’re beating it to death at the track, not if you’re just driving it.
Been working on cars for over 40 years, built high end custom motorcycles that have been featured in major magazines, still own and keep running late sixties muscle cars, British sports cars, an antique Harley that is way far from being stock and a 10’ long custom chopper with a big cubic inch motor and it will fly and actually handles correctly, trained machinist, custom painter and pretty skilled at doing custom sheet metal work. This new turbo car put me in a category of not being able to succeed.
I wish all you guys good luck with these cars.